Perma Ban - Appeal for Griefing
Posted: Thu Mar 21, 2019 10:42 am
BYOND Name: 4rchibald
Reason Banned: Griefed the gravity generator and bombed the CE with a handmade grenade. DC'd after with out saying anything
Admin who banned: Derkuleen
Length Banned: PERM
Appeal Reason: I was banned in round ID 16791, this is the same case as Hulton's .
I was exploring station with my friend, we're still fairly new to this game, we don't know the map. Nothing dramatic was happening at the moment so we felt like we can leave our workplaces (Actually as an engineer I feel like patrolling rooms and checking if everything's alright would be one of my duties). We have checked few places, including supermatter reactor, which as far as I know is easy to disrupt and hard to fix for people who don't understand it and nothing was damaged on our way, if we wanted to disrupt the server we would surely go for it. Yes, we came close to gravity generator, we entered that room but our mischief was done in room next to it-we saw secure doors and decided to check what's inside. I did the hacking and I managed to open the doors. Then Chief Engineer came. He noticed us and asked what we were doing there, we panicked but were trying to make some excuses when he attacked us, before fully explaining situation or calling security even thou we were not a direct threat, first my friend and then, after he knocked him down, me. CE and I both left the room when grenade exploded. Hulton used it not to kill CE but himself, fact that me and CE survived that explosion is a proof of that. I died just after that, beaten and sucked out by that explosion-made hole.
We disconnected because we didn't think there was anything else left to do. Our corpses were taken to security area and after listening to conversation about our situation I didn't feel there was any will to clone us-we were done for that round.
CE wasn't a target of grenade, it was act of suicide. Also, I already talked with Wizard on discord and he checked the logs to prove we didn't attack him and since we were attacked if Hulton would throw a grenade it would still be in self defence so I believe he would be in his right.
Should we open the doors to secure storage room? Rules seem to be stating that we shouldn't be self antagging, but was is breaking that rule? Where's the line? If we were all expected to follow just our job description we wouldn't need security guards, but we have them. True role playing requires people to be faulty, require them to make stupid decisions, to go where they shouldn't, to do something more or less unpleasant to others, sometimes as a joke, sometimes because of some conflict. I fully understand rule that stops us from destroying station in 15 minutes as it often happens on other servers but it shouldn't stop us from minor incidents because that's how people act in real life and we try to recreate that by roleplaying. It was never our intention to destroy the station and disrupt what others were doing.
Yesterday I pissed off one guard, surely did enough to get arrested (those are the only two situations I was in conflict with law and I don't think that first one was griefing either, it surely wasn't recognized as such by anyone), but he had a bad day or was particularly mad at me so first he used metal gas bottle with oxygen he took from me to break my legs when no other guard was around, then he took me to my cell where I was sure I will spent rest of my arrest in peace but that guard brought another player from engineering or cargo, he was not a felon, he was a friend of a guard and was let in just for that-he beat me heavily until he was bored. Was that griefing? Was that antagging? Was that toxic? Should I complain to admins about that guard and his friend who had no business there whatsoever and was allowed to restricted area just to abuse other player? Or maybe was that role playing, there was a dirty guard who doesn't always play by the rules and he's scum friend who just wants to beat other people and is allowed to do that to prisoners? This is one of situations we can see in law enforcement and prison system, not everyone is crystal clear. And I'm really curious about your take on that because I can't see how one situation could be within rules and other wasn't and if they both were breaking the rules I would like to know what people can do on this server and what security guards and their cells are for if acting outside duties is punished by ban. I really hope to get some answers on that to clarify not only my case but rules of the server for everyone.
Whatever you will say on that I will just come back to my specific case and state-it was never my intention to disrupt gameflow of other players, I wasn't trying to be an antagonist, didn't try to disrupt any major system necessary for proper station operation and I didn't attack CE but was attacked by him. I believed and still believe I was acting like a proper roleplayer and if I broke any station rules as character I should take ingame responsibility as that character-being imprisoned or if situation led to it, killed. I don't believe that I should be banned for that, nor should Hulton or anyone else.
Reason Banned: Griefed the gravity generator and bombed the CE with a handmade grenade. DC'd after with out saying anything
Admin who banned: Derkuleen
Length Banned: PERM
Appeal Reason: I was banned in round ID 16791, this is the same case as Hulton's .
I was exploring station with my friend, we're still fairly new to this game, we don't know the map. Nothing dramatic was happening at the moment so we felt like we can leave our workplaces (Actually as an engineer I feel like patrolling rooms and checking if everything's alright would be one of my duties). We have checked few places, including supermatter reactor, which as far as I know is easy to disrupt and hard to fix for people who don't understand it and nothing was damaged on our way, if we wanted to disrupt the server we would surely go for it. Yes, we came close to gravity generator, we entered that room but our mischief was done in room next to it-we saw secure doors and decided to check what's inside. I did the hacking and I managed to open the doors. Then Chief Engineer came. He noticed us and asked what we were doing there, we panicked but were trying to make some excuses when he attacked us, before fully explaining situation or calling security even thou we were not a direct threat, first my friend and then, after he knocked him down, me. CE and I both left the room when grenade exploded. Hulton used it not to kill CE but himself, fact that me and CE survived that explosion is a proof of that. I died just after that, beaten and sucked out by that explosion-made hole.
We disconnected because we didn't think there was anything else left to do. Our corpses were taken to security area and after listening to conversation about our situation I didn't feel there was any will to clone us-we were done for that round.
CE wasn't a target of grenade, it was act of suicide. Also, I already talked with Wizard on discord and he checked the logs to prove we didn't attack him and since we were attacked if Hulton would throw a grenade it would still be in self defence so I believe he would be in his right.
Should we open the doors to secure storage room? Rules seem to be stating that we shouldn't be self antagging, but was is breaking that rule? Where's the line? If we were all expected to follow just our job description we wouldn't need security guards, but we have them. True role playing requires people to be faulty, require them to make stupid decisions, to go where they shouldn't, to do something more or less unpleasant to others, sometimes as a joke, sometimes because of some conflict. I fully understand rule that stops us from destroying station in 15 minutes as it often happens on other servers but it shouldn't stop us from minor incidents because that's how people act in real life and we try to recreate that by roleplaying. It was never our intention to destroy the station and disrupt what others were doing.
Yesterday I pissed off one guard, surely did enough to get arrested (those are the only two situations I was in conflict with law and I don't think that first one was griefing either, it surely wasn't recognized as such by anyone), but he had a bad day or was particularly mad at me so first he used metal gas bottle with oxygen he took from me to break my legs when no other guard was around, then he took me to my cell where I was sure I will spent rest of my arrest in peace but that guard brought another player from engineering or cargo, he was not a felon, he was a friend of a guard and was let in just for that-he beat me heavily until he was bored. Was that griefing? Was that antagging? Was that toxic? Should I complain to admins about that guard and his friend who had no business there whatsoever and was allowed to restricted area just to abuse other player? Or maybe was that role playing, there was a dirty guard who doesn't always play by the rules and he's scum friend who just wants to beat other people and is allowed to do that to prisoners? This is one of situations we can see in law enforcement and prison system, not everyone is crystal clear. And I'm really curious about your take on that because I can't see how one situation could be within rules and other wasn't and if they both were breaking the rules I would like to know what people can do on this server and what security guards and their cells are for if acting outside duties is punished by ban. I really hope to get some answers on that to clarify not only my case but rules of the server for everyone.
Whatever you will say on that I will just come back to my specific case and state-it was never my intention to disrupt gameflow of other players, I wasn't trying to be an antagonist, didn't try to disrupt any major system necessary for proper station operation and I didn't attack CE but was attacked by him. I believed and still believe I was acting like a proper roleplayer and if I broke any station rules as character I should take ingame responsibility as that character-being imprisoned or if situation led to it, killed. I don't believe that I should be banned for that, nor should Hulton or anyone else.